power to weight ratio??

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ultimate0
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power to weight ratio??

Post by ultimate0 »

Alo agan2 skalian...penasaran neh gmn carany itung power to weight ratio?? Ap bs dijadikan acuan buat tahu performa sbuah mobil/motor?? Ato mungkin agan2 skalian bs share jg power to weight ratio dri kndaraan agan2...
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by andy1800 »

Peak nya power to weight ratio ya = peak power dibagi dg berat kendaraan dlm kondisi stdar (curb weight).
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evolution21
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by evolution21 »

dr pengamatan ane ya,
kalo hasil bagi yg seperti um andy bilang kurang dari 0,1 biasanya tu mobil lemot
deket2 0,1 pas2an
lebih dari 0,1 ngacir

tp kalo diesel tidak berlaku karena hp nya kecil tp torsinya besar
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by Nightster Guy »

1) cara itung?

mau nggak mau ya percaya ama brosur/data pabrikan hehehe.... karena? utk ngitung output power real mobil kita, mesti di dyno test. ribed dan buang duit kalo hanya sekedar pengen ngitung brapa output mobil kita. plus tiap brand mesin dyno outputnya beda2 hehe contoh antara dastek vs dyno dynamics. pasti beda (banyak) tuh ngukur di dastek vs dyno dynamics.

2) utk ngitung berat, tauk deh gimana caranya. masak iya mo ke jembatan timbangnya DLLAJR?

3) utk acuan kasar komparasi performa? iya. dengan catatan ini nggak mutlak, sangaaaaat banyak parameter lain sebagai faktor kalkulasi performa saat dikebut. karakteristik mesin, drivetrain, dll.

4) jangan lupa, data di brosur juga mesti dikalibrasi antar brand, sama nggak tuh metode ngukurnya. Ada SAE rating vs DIN rating vs JIS rating, juga gross vs net.

5) bobot mobil juga ada curb weight (kosongan) vs GVW.

6) CMIIW. :mky_01:
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by ultimate0 »

Pake satuan ap buat power & curb weight ny? Trus misal dri data brosur antara brio & new aveo...sama2 punya 100 ps power...new aveo lebih berat...klo pake itungan itu bs dijadikan acuan buat komparasi kemampuan 2 mbl tsb? Klo dri logikany seh harusny new aveo lbh lambat akselerasi...(sorry klo salah..msh noob neh.haha..)
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by mr-saga »

ultimate0 wrote:Pake satuan ap buat power & curb weight ny? Trus misal dri data brosur antara brio & new aveo...sama2 punya 100 ps power...new aveo lebih berat...klo pake itungan itu bs dijadikan acuan buat komparasi kemampuan 2 mbl tsb? Klo dri logikany seh harusny new aveo lbh lambat akselerasi...(sorry klo salah..msh noob neh.haha..)
pakai satuan apa aja blh kok Om, yg penting sama.. :e-dance:
klo ane biasanya jg memperhatiin wheelbase/jarak sumbu roda.

bobot nya Brio brp sih Om?
ane cek di web Honda Prospek kok gak ada datanya..

gmn klo sekalian jg dibahas dsini data2nya.. biar jls. :mky_01:
Last edited by mr-saga on Mon Oct 22, 2012 12:36, edited 1 time in total.
> kendaraan yg menyesuaikan dg kondisi jalan?
> jalanan yg menyesuaikan dg kondisi kendaraan?
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by dany_pos »

klo power to weight ratio kecil tapi torsi besar, mobilnya ngacir juga kah? trus coeficient of drag pengaruhnya besar atau kecil?
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by andy1800 »

ultimate0 wrote:Pake satuan ap buat power & curb weight ny? Trus misal dri data brosur antara brio & new aveo...sama2 punya 100 ps power...new aveo lebih berat...klo pake itungan itu bs dijadikan acuan buat komparasi kemampuan 2 mbl tsb? Klo dri logikany seh harusny new aveo lbh lambat akselerasi...(sorry klo salah..msh noob neh.haha..)
ga perlu sorry cm krn msh noob. emang ultimate0 ini msh kuliah atau blm lama lulusnya?

spt dah dijelasin sm temens di atas2 itu ya, bhw:
- satuan bs apa aja. klo mau bandingin mobil, intinya ya satuannya hrs sama.
- utk sederhananya kesimpulan logikanya mmg bs begitu.

- ok let's step by step... skrg coba tulis sini aja dulu data dari brosur2 itu. terutama peak power dan peak torque. lgkap sm satuannya ya, dan tulislah disini persis sm yg tertulis di brosur itu yak.

stlh itu bisa kita lanjut
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by Unta_item »

ultimate0 wrote:Alo agan2 skalian...penasaran neh gmn carany itung power to weight ratio?? Ap bs dijadikan acuan buat tahu performa sbuah mobil/motor?? Ato mungkin agan2 skalian bs share jg power to weight ratio dri kndaraan agan2...
ngak bisa dibandingkan karena perhitungan secara kasar, buat lari itu banyak faktor,
mulai dari kaki kanan pengemudi cara injak gas, kecepatan oper verneling/ kecanggihan maticnya, tentu beda dunk maticnya mercedes 7 speed lalu dibandingkan ama maticnya avansa misalnya, aerodinamis mobil, kondisi pengetasan cuaca, dll

paling gampang ya ngajak temen aja yang punya mobil lain lalu diajak ngebut. ngetrack bareng2 .. :mky_02:
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evolution21
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by evolution21 »

dany_pos wrote:klo power to weight ratio kecil tapi torsi besar, mobilnya ngacir juga kah? trus coeficient of drag pengaruhnya besar atau kecil?
contohnya captiva diesel
cuman 160 hp tapi torsinya 360nm
bobot 1,7 sampai hampir 2ton

kalo liat hp doank kayak pas2an cenderung lemot
tapi karena torsi besar, pas dicoba di aspal berasa galak banget
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by imsus2c »

evolution21 wrote:
dany_pos wrote:klo power to weight ratio kecil tapi torsi besar, mobilnya ngacir juga kah? trus coeficient of drag pengaruhnya besar atau kecil?
contohnya captiva diesel
cuman 160 hp tapi torsinya 360nm
bobot 1,7 sampai hampir 2ton

kalo liat hp doank kayak pas2an cenderung lemot
tapi karena torsi besar, pas dicoba di aspal berasa galak banget
hanya sayangnya, saat ini rasio gigi mobil diesel (penumopang/passenger) biasanya lebih halus dibanding bensin dan bentang tenaganya (powerband) juga lebih pendek

lama lama, nanti topicnya bisa nyambung kesini
si vis pacem para bellum - si vis bellum para pacem - si vis pacem para pactum
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by iamwewe »

dany_pos wrote:klo power to weight ratio kecil tapi torsi besar, mobilnya ngacir juga kah? trus coeficient of drag pengaruhnya besar atau kecil?
kalo dari ilmu awam sotoy saya kayanya HP itu nentuin max speed deh, kalo torsi kayanya masalah menggerakkan mobil dari diam ke gerak gitu (accel kali yak). coefficient of drag ngaruhnya gede bangetngetnget dong..
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Re: power to weight ratio??

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evolution21 wrote:
dany_pos wrote:klo power to weight ratio kecil tapi torsi besar, mobilnya ngacir juga kah? trus coeficient of drag pengaruhnya besar atau kecil?
contohnya captiva diesel
cuman 160 hp tapi torsinya 360nm
bobot 1,7 sampai hampir 2ton

kalo liat hp doank kayak pas2an cenderung lemot
tapi karena torsi besar, pas dicoba di aspal berasa galak banget
hadeh2.. ini captiva diesel yg paling baru sih bengis gila larinya. ngejar pake mazda2 nggak kekejar. ngejar pake xtrail 2.5 ngap2an. di tanjakan cipularang sih siap2 telen tinta hitam cumi2 captiva aja :mky_04:
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by ultimate0 »

andy1800 wrote:
ultimate0 wrote:Pake satuan ap buat power & curb weight ny? Trus misal dri data brosur antara brio & new aveo...sama2 punya 100 ps power...new aveo lebih berat...klo pake itungan itu bs dijadikan acuan buat komparasi kemampuan 2 mbl tsb? Klo dri logikany seh harusny new aveo lbh lambat akselerasi...(sorry klo salah..msh noob neh.haha..)
ga perlu sorry cm krn msh noob. emang ultimate0 ini msh kuliah atau blm lama lulusnya?

spt dah dijelasin sm temens di atas2 itu ya, bhw:
- satuan bs apa aja. klo mau bandingin mobil, intinya ya satuannya hrs sama.
- utk sederhananya kesimpulan logikanya mmg bs begitu.

- ok let's step by step... skrg coba tulis sini aja dulu data dari brosur2 itu. terutama peak power dan peak torque. lgkap sm satuannya ya, dan tulislah disini persis sm yg tertulis di brosur itu yak.

stlh itu bisa kita lanjut
Berikut bbrp spek dri brosur yg sy punya:
*Brio M/T
Mesin: 1.3L SOHC 4 silinder segaris,16 katup i-VTEC+DBW

Sistem suplai bahan bakar: PGM-FI

Diameter x langkah(mm): 73x80

Isi silinder(cc): 1.339

Perbandingan komperasi: 10,5:1

Daya maks Kw(PS)/rpm: 73(100)/6000
Momen puntir maks Kg.m(Nm)/rpm: 13(127)/4800

PxLxT (mm): 3.160x1.680x1.485
Jarak sumbu roda (mm): 2.345
Berat kosong (kg): 920/925 (berdasarkan data dri wikipedia,majalah lokal, & brosur brio versi thailand. Krn di brosur versi lokal ga ad)
Ban: 175/65 R14

Suspensi:
Depan: McPherson Strut
Belakang: H-Shape Torsion Beam

Perbandingan gigi (M/T):
1st: 3,307
2nd: 1,750
3rd: 1,171
4th: 0,853
5th: 0,727
Reverse: 3,307
Final gear: 4,625

--------------------------------------------------------------

*New Aveo M/T

Mesin: 1.4L,DOHC, 16 valve, 4 CYL,Variable Timing

Fuel system: injection-multi points

Bore x stroke (mm): 73,4 x 82,6

Displacement (cc): 1,398

Compression ratio: 10,5:1

Max power (PS/rpm): 100/6000
Max torque (Nm/rpm): 130/4000

PxLxT (mm): 4039x1735x1517
Wheelbase (mm): 2,525
Curb weight (kg): 1.253
Tire: 195/65 R15

Suspensi:
Depan: MacPherson Struts with direct acting stabilizer bar
Belakang: Compound crank with double walled V beam

Gear ratio:
1st: 3,727
2nd: 1,960
3rd: 1,323
4th: 0,946
5th: 0,756
reverse: 3,308
Final gear: (ga ad di brosur)

-----------------------------------------------------------

Silahkan dibahas mana yg lbih baik. Kebetulan kedua mbl ini punya spek power mesin yg sama mnurut brosur...
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by Nightster Guy »

hwadhuh.........

kalo pertanyaannya luas dan dalam: mana yang lebih baik antara brio vs aveo? maka nggak akan bs dijawab HANYA by brochure dan HANYA MENGACU pada teori power to weight ratio bro. :)

skali lg, seperti udah sy dan temen2 lain jawab di atas, semua spendapat: YA, pd dasarnya begitulah perhitungan kasarnya. power to weight ratio makin besar ya makin bagus, tp itu cm sebagai perhitungan awal/kasar aja.

mana yg lebih baik, rasio antara brio vs aveo? DI ATAS KERTAS, brio lebih bagus rasionya. jadi, performa brio lebih unggul? NTAR DULU, perlu dites nyata. :)
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by Megalontong »

Beli mobil via bandingin brosur?
Dua mobil sama horsepower & torsi maxnya, beda di karakteristik power delivery.
Yaris tarikan bawah, jazz tarikan atas. Di kemacetan enak Yaris. Padahal speknya mirip2 di brosur.
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by andy1800 »

ultimate0 wrote:
andy1800 wrote:
ultimate0 wrote:Pake satuan ap buat power & curb weight ny? Trus misal dri data brosur antara brio & new aveo...sama2 punya 100 ps power...new aveo lebih berat...klo pake itungan itu bs dijadikan acuan buat komparasi kemampuan 2 mbl tsb? Klo dri logikany seh harusny new aveo lbh lambat akselerasi...(sorry klo salah..msh noob neh.haha..)
ga perlu sorry cm krn msh noob. emang ultimate0 ini msh kuliah atau blm lama lulusnya?

spt dah dijelasin sm temens di atas2 itu ya, bhw:
- satuan bs apa aja. klo mau bandingin mobil, intinya ya satuannya hrs sama.
- utk sederhananya kesimpulan logikanya mmg bs begitu.

- ok let's step by step... skrg coba tulis sini aja dulu data dari brosur2 itu. terutama peak power dan peak torque. lgkap sm satuannya ya, dan tulislah disini persis sm yg tertulis di brosur itu yak.

stlh itu bisa kita lanjut
Berikut bbrp spek dri brosur yg sy punya:
*Brio M/T
Mesin: 1.3L SOHC 4 silinder segaris,16 katup i-VTEC+DBW

Sistem suplai bahan bakar: PGM-FI

Diameter x langkah(mm): 73x80

Isi silinder(cc): 1.339

Perbandingan komperasi: 10,5:1

Daya maks Kw(PS)/rpm: 73(100)/6000
Momen puntir maks Kg.m(Nm)/rpm: 13(127)/4800

PxLxT (mm): 3.160x1.680x1.485
Jarak sumbu roda (mm): 2.345
Berat kosong (kg): 920/925 (berdasarkan data dri wikipedia,majalah lokal, & brosur brio versi thailand. Krn di brosur versi lokal ga ad)
Ban: 175/65 R14

Suspensi:
Depan: McPherson Strut
Belakang: H-Shape Torsion Beam

Perbandingan gigi (M/T):
1st: 3,307
2nd: 1,750
3rd: 1,171
4th: 0,853
5th: 0,727
Reverse: 3,307
Final gear: 4,625

--------------------------------------------------------------

*New Aveo M/T

Mesin: 1.4L,DOHC, 16 valve, 4 CYL,Variable Timing

Fuel system: injection-multi points

Bore x stroke (mm): 73,4 x 82,6

Displacement (cc): 1,398

Compression ratio: 10,5:1

Max power (PS/rpm): 100/6000
Max torque (Nm/rpm): 130/4000

PxLxT (mm): 4039x1735x1517
Wheelbase (mm): 2,525
Curb weight (kg): 1.253
Tire: 195/65 R15

Suspensi:
Depan: MacPherson Struts with direct acting stabilizer bar
Belakang: Compound crank with double walled V beam

Gear ratio:
1st: 3,727
2nd: 1,960
3rd: 1,323
4th: 0,946
5th: 0,756
reverse: 3,308
Final gear: (ga ad di brosur)

-----------------------------------------------------------

Silahkan dibahas mana yg lbih baik. Kebetulan kedua mbl ini punya spek power mesin yg sama mnurut brosur...
good :off_good_job:
ok, jd bro ultimate pengen metode pembahasan secara step by step ala "for dummies" dulu...atau pgn lsg advance?
sdgkan yg dah dikemukakan sm masters/guru2 di atas, adlh metode pengajaran utk yg attending di kelas advance.
sukur klo bro ultimate dah bisa lsg mencernanya. :off_good_job: klo mmg begitu maka case will be closed soon
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evolution21
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by evolution21 »

power sama2 100hp
tp bobot selisih 200kg
ya yg lebih ringan yg menang

power to weight ratio
brio 100/925 = 0.108
aveo 100/1253 = 0.079

kalo cuman hitung2an diatas kertas semestinya brio menang, menang telak malahan
tapi itu semua harus di tes lg di aspal beneran
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by JESKONENG »

PWR adalah salah 1 faktor aja yg menentukan performa mobil/motor... ada satu faktor lain yg sangat menentukan performa, yaitu gear ratio (perbandingan gigi dalam girboks) dan kalok utk motor ada 1 lagi yaitu sprocket ratio (perbandingan gir depan dan blakang)... Perbandingan gear ratio dalam girboks dan perbandingan sprocket SANGAT BERPENGARUH pada performa akselerasi dan topspeed. Pada mobil, perbedaan signifikan adalah gear ratio antara mobil utk on-road dan yg utk off-road, maka performanya juga sangat beda...
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by Megalontong »

evolution21 wrote:power sama2 100hp
tp bobot selisih 200kg
ya yg lebih ringan yg menang

power to weight ratio
brio 100/925 = 0.108
aveo 100/1253 = 0.079

kalo cuman hitung2an diatas kertas semestinya brio menang, menang telak malahan
tapi itu semua harus di tes lg di aspal beneran

Spek brosur sih begitu, tapi pertanyaannya apa boil jepang bisa explore semua horsepowernya itu dengan grip pas2an?
Anda ngebut pakai 206 1.4 / polo 1.4 tenaga pas bobot mantap, dengan boil jepun (misal Jazz) yg spek horsepower besar bodi kapas. Boil eropa trek lurus & nikung high speed mobil masih lengket dengan aspal.
Sudah rahasia umum jalan toll & gunung bukan area bermain boil yg "garang spek brosurnya".

Pinjem istilah beken : power is nothing without grip.
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evolution21
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by evolution21 »

ya plus minus tiap mobil itu
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by ultimate0 »

@andy1800: Pembahasan dri step by step aj..krn sy butuh bnyk blajar..haha...

@all: thx y buat masukan dri para master...sy jd tambah wawasan bru...klo ad tambahan ilmu2 bru...bole skalian dishare di sini...buat komparasi mobil2.....btw gear ratio itu bs ngaruh apa y buat mobil? Sy ga ngerti soal gear ratio.. Contohny kyk spek brosur brio & aveo...power sama..tp gear ratio beda...ternyata bnyk faktor jg y dlm nentuin performa mbl...jd tambah bingung dh sy...haha...
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evolution21
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by evolution21 »

oh ya gear ratio gimana ya kalo ngeliat spek gitu
kadang kan ada tu mobil yg terasa tiap giginya terlalu pendek, ada yg terlalu panjang
kalo boleh dilampirkan gear rationya mobil2 honda / mitsubishi / mazda
3 merek ini biasanya terasa pas, enak dipake, terasa sporty perpindahan giginya
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by Unta_item »

iamwewe wrote:
evolution21 wrote:
dany_pos wrote:klo power to weight ratio kecil tapi torsi besar, mobilnya ngacir juga kah? trus coeficient of drag pengaruhnya besar atau kecil?
contohnya captiva diesel
cuman 160 hp tapi torsinya 360nm
bobot 1,7 sampai hampir 2ton

kalo liat hp doank kayak pas2an cenderung lemot
tapi karena torsi besar, pas dicoba di aspal berasa galak banget
hadeh2.. ini captiva diesel yg paling baru sih bengis gila larinya. ngejar pake mazda2 nggak kekejar. ngejar pake xtrail 2.5 ngap2an. di tanjakan cipularang sih siap2 telen tinta hitam cumi2 captiva aja :mky_04:
Kejar Captiva diesel ya Pake BMW X1 Diesel sama sama 2000 cc dieselnya .... :mky_02: :mky_02: :mky_02:
http://yamatoikwan.blogspot.com/
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Pojok-Un ... 0505942274
Kalau Bisa diperbaiki ya jangan diganti, Kalau bisa bikin sendiri mengapa harus beli ?
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Re: power to weight ratio??

Post by Deasegara »

evolution21 wrote:
dany_pos wrote:klo power to weight ratio kecil tapi torsi besar, mobilnya ngacir juga kah? trus coeficient of drag pengaruhnya besar atau kecil?
contohnya captiva diesel
cuman 160 hp tapi torsinya 360nm
bobot 1,7 sampai hampir 2ton

kalo liat hp doank kayak pas2an cenderung lemot
tapi karena torsi besar, pas dicoba di aspal berasa galak banget
hadeh2.. ini captiva diesel yg paling baru sih bengis gila larinya. ngejar pake mazda2 nggak kekejar. ngejar pake xtrail 2.5 ngap2an. di tanjakan cipularang sih siap2 telen tinta hitam cumi2 captiva aja :mky_04:[/quote]

Kejar Captiva diesel ya Pake BMW X1 Diesel sama sama 2000 cc dieselnya .... :mky_02: :mky_02: :mky_02:[/quote]

Gak usah pake BMW bro, coba kejar pake Hyundai i20 CRDI, ada kawan pake standard full biosolar bisa dapat 180 kph pedal gas belum kena lantai...