Meski Perlahan, Pasar MPV Kelas Atas Menjajikan

[observer]

Mr. Szli, to convince Mr. QiuQiu, u just have to remind him that you've been telling people to buy Astra's stocks, so u couldn't possibly be a NMI agent, right?

Or perhaps Mr. QiuQiu is just pulling your leg for being so.....PRO Nissan n Carlos Ghosn! U just don't stop raving about C24 (even I am getting embarassed as an owner), and most recently Tiida n Elgrand.

Anyone who go through your recent postings would quickly spot your special affections (or fanatisms) for Nissan products. In fact, I'm afraid your overzealousness might have made your opinion, however objective, seem less so as far as Nissan products are concerned.

Back to the topic about safety. Saya pernah baca di majalah Autobild (?) bahwa rasio pengendara yang menggungkan sabuk pengaman meningkat secara tajam sejak diwajibkan oleh pemerintah, dari minoritas (<25%) sebelum peraturan, menjadi mayoritas (>75%) setelah peraturan.

Saya kira untuk airbag juga sama. Kalau tidak dimulai dari peraturan pemerintah, sampai kapan pun tetap Kijang akan dijual dengan varian tanpa airbag, dan varian itulah yang paling laris (bukan orang Indonesia tidak sayang nyawa, tapi mereka lebih sayang duit!! ) So I'm 100% yakin AUV yang menjadi pesaingnya Kijang juga sudah pasti akan ada varian yang non-airbag.

[conan]

U just don't stop raving about C24 (even I am getting embarassed as an owner)

Kekekeke!

It takes the sentence there's nothing wrong with being proud with your car into 'the next level', does it not...

Well, Mr. Szli, will you finally admit it that you're a...Nissan fanatic? (A Nissan fanatic with Toyota stocks, funnily enough )

And remember, denial is the first sign of...addiction. Kekekeke

[conan]

Seperti bung conan yang sekarang bilang my car jadi basi, sudah bukan model yang mutakhir, boxy,

Oh, please don't get me wrong, Mr. Szli, I still like the C24. Would take it over any Innova in a heartbeat. But wouldn't take it over the C25, if I have the choice.

[QiuQiu]

Ok, saya bicara blak-blak-an saja yach, memang karakter saya di kehidupan nyata memang begitu.

Adapun saya bicara begitu tentu saja ada alasannya, saya ingat berkali-kali apa yang bung Szli ungkapkan akhirnya publish di media dengan content yang sama, contoh saja topik mengenai serena pakai premium, dan besoknya langsung muncul di autobild terbaru

Banyak komentar anda yang menurut aku nadanya miring dan susah untuk dicerna dengan baik, bukan hanya capsul, bahkan juga innova yg baru saja di-launching
Berkali-kali di posting anda bilang, bahwa Toyota akan kalah dengan Nissan.
Ini mungkin, tapi probabilitanya masih kecil saat ini, jd kalau bolak balik ngomong begituan, kesannya gimana.
Kita semua di sini tahu bahwa Toyota itu di pasar internasional lagi naik pamornya, saat ini nomer dua, setelah itu masih ada Ford, VW, DaimlerChrysler, Peugeot Citroen, Kia Hyundai dan lain-lain
Di pasar nasional, Toyota nomer satu, terus ada mitsubishi, suzuki, daihatsu, honda dan lain-lain.

Untuk mengatakan Nissan mengalahkan Toyota dalam jangka dekat, orang yg normal pasti akan mikir tujuh kali
Kecuali hal itu dilakukan di briefing2 sales yg biasa dilakukan tiap pagi (itu cuma untuk pompa semangat divisi sales saja, kalau ngomong di luaran bisa diketawai orang )

to @Observer : Mengenai saham astra memang di sini tidak ada yg dengar bahwa holdingnya NMI juga punya saham astra, semua orang yang main saham perasaan tahu mengenai hal ini. Salah satu gosipnya menyatakan bahwa founder astra mental dari asii juga gara-gara group yang waktu itu dekat dengan kekuasaan menginginkan saham itu

Kalau Bung Szli tersinggung mohon maaf saja, niat saya baik, untuk mengingatkan bahwa tidak ada gunanya kita melakukan tindakan yang kontraproduktif

to @member lainnya : saya juga minta maaf karena telah mengganggu ketentraman warga forum ini

[observer]

Kekeke, Mr. Szli, I just can't help to point this out, that I thought other people in this forum had worst things to say about u, like: "... anyone with a brain would know.....", and yet u seem to take no offense...

[conan]

Btw Mr. Observer, siapa sih yang Anda maksud? Kekekeke..

[hdrw]

Bung Qiu Qiu, rupanya anda orangnya ceplas ceplos juga yah.
And bung Szli jangan emosi dulu, benar kata bung conan, walaupun bung Qiu Qiu 'nembak' langsung ke anda, tapikan tidak ada harsh words, itukan berarti dia masih menghargai anda.
Memang sepertinya tipe anda berdua sama dalam menyampaikan pendapat.

Seperti iklan Mercy yang saya suka banget.
" Nothing makes a driver more faithful to his car, than a car which is faithful to its owner ".

I will leave this one to Watson..

he he he ... enak ajah ninggalin kerjaan, lagi males posting nih.

[pinoh_boy]

Yeah! Peace!

[mpoezz]

damai di hati damai di bumi

[handling]

Kenapa ngak naik darah ! NGak ada bukti main bilang saya orang NMI. I am not that cheap ! If I am orang NMI, ngak usah main di sini. .....bla...bla..

....... Sudah berapa kali saya ama mereka " Cross swords " tapi ngak pernah tuh bikin saya jengkel sampai gini. They are good with words and diplomacy. Thats the difference !

Stay Cool bung Szli dan Bung QiuQiu. Gak usah terpancing jadi panas kok bung Szli dan bung QiuQiu hanya karena kata yang blak2 an...yang penting gak ada kata2 kasar.. justru ini lebih bagus daripada harus nutup2i keunggulan dan kelemahan masing2 produk. Toh gak ada yang sempurna kan...

Saya ingat bung Hdrw amat kesal ama saya. Tapi bahasa dia masih seperti diplomat negara, dia ajukan protes dengan bahasa yang masih bisa di telan. So akhirnya saya appreciate.

Kalo saya malah lebih suka gaya bicara yang blak2an seperti Bung Szli dan Bung QiuQiu daripada yang berbau menyindir2. Kecuali untuk mengikuti karakter lawan bicara kita yang berbau menyindir2.
Saya juga pernah ngalamin hal yang samaseperti dgn Mr. X yang bergaya bicara munafik dan menyindir2 . Untuk pertama kali di topik [cencored] saya tahan aja. Tapi untuk kedua kali di topik YYY saya udah gak tahan dengan gaya bicaranya yang munafik dan menyindir2 sampe istri saya juga udah ikut2an kesel juga...ha.h.a.ha.ha..a....Mungkin kalo rekan2 SM yang sering ikutin tahu di thread yang mana...ha.a.ha..haa.a.....

Saya mampir di forum ini karena forum ini memang beda dgn forum lain yang kadang saking ngomongnya kasar2 bisa bikin ketawa..... ......so keep posting guys...

Ngomong2 bung szli, tagihan internet gua juga jadi naik nih gara2 ikutan SM bukan cuma lu aja.....ha..ha.h.a.ha..a.
Saran gua buat rekan2 kalo posting jangan panjang lebar dong...kan bacanya lama .....ha.h.a.ha. mesti mencontoh bung mpoezz nih yang komentarnya super singkat dan jelas....like this...

damai di hati damai di bumi

ha.ha.h.a.ha.ha..Just kidding bung mpoezz

[szli]

OK OK. Fine. U got to know ! Hidup jaman sekarang, apalagi di Jakarta itu penuh dengan STRESS dan frustration ! Jadi seperti duduk di gudang Dynamite ! Sedikit api saja gampang meledak !

I must say my life now is not like the Sampoerna guys, a bed of roses ! But of course I will keep this to myself ! At least kenapa saya suka main di forum ini, It relieves stress ! Talk abt cars which my wife would yawn kalau saya start talking !

OK. Bung Qiu Qiu, we sign a peace Treaty, which hopefully will last a long long time. I maybe under stress sometimes, gampang meledak sometimes, but I am not Stalin. I can be reasonable if required.

Last thing, I did not say Toyota will be replaced by Nissan in a short time. Jangan salah. I have their sales figures. OK enough of this.

Well, kadang saya kesan terlalu sering ngomong c24. Mungkin like Mr. OBs, bilang jadi norak. But guys, I have only 2 cars. The Stream sudah ngak exciting lagi. c24 is my only other car which still makes me happy.

Well, pahamlah, seperti ngomong terus tentang bayi yang baru lahir. Betapa lucunya dia, betapa cutenya dia. But don't worry, after a while, like all new born fathers, I will stop. In fact I am slowing down a lot right now.

This forum is indeed special. Biasanya orang pakai nama palsu itu bisa sangat gila dan kasar banget. Yet I see many people with cool heads here. I wonder, how could this be ?

Ngomong ngomong, ironically, U know what ? Kenapa and how saya bisa ketemu forum ini ? Its not trying to search for c24 pictures. Saya sudah dapat dari internet.

Its my hard attempt to find Innova pre born pictures that I was astonished, wow forum ini bisa ada photo rahasia Innova itu. Right under Johny Darmawan's nose right inside the Toyota factory ! Thats why saat itu saya pikir, gila, banyak spy handal di forum ini. Thus my addiction continues till today.

So, in a twist of fate, it was the Toyota Innova that brought me to this forum.

Is bung TomCat yang mendirikan forum ini ? Kapan lahirnya forum ini ? Some historical background abt this forum will be interesting.

[conan]

This forum is indeed special. Biasanya orang pakai nama palsu itu bisa sangat gila dan kasar banget. Yet I see many people with cool heads here. I wonder, how could this be ?

Benar, bung Szli..misalnya Anda dan Mr. Qiuqiu yang suka blak2an, tapi melihat dari sejarah posting kalian, I can have nothing but the proper respect for you two. Tapi ada juga koq orang yang 'menyebalkan', bicara blak2an tapi berpandangan sempit dan keras kepala...hahaha. It's best to just ignore them.

[szli]

Saya sekarang lagi nonton American Idol yang lagi heboh itu.

Dan yang nonton mungkin akan rasa saya seperti that Judge Simon apa namanya.

Dia paling cerewet. Sedikit salah dia pasti ngomong. So tiap kali dia buka mulut, banyak penonton yang Booo !

Maybe I should mix Simon and Paula Abdul !

[szli]

Abt the fact that kenapa kadang saya take no offense at certain words, gini ceritanya :

Kalau saya ada feeling ini orang mungkin lagi arahkan senapannya ke arah saya, kadang saya " Dodge ", leave U to guess what that means

For Bung Qiu2's case, kebetulan saya ngak expect kapal dia akan muncul, so when his cannons opened fire, saya ngak dodge and it smacked right into my face, right between my eyes !

So I yelled " Ouch ! Damn ! ". And of course I ordered my frigate captain to return fire at that frigate that just made a big hole in my ship ! Pirates of the Caribbean Style !

Well, like all war veterans ultimately, biasanya later malah sadar, war is the worst thing man can do to each other.

[observer]

Hahaha, Mr. Szli, very interesting and graphic explanation!

Btw, I am quite seriously considering to trade in my blackie for a fortuner (I know Mr. Conan is gonna say: "told u so"). The only thing stopping me from doing it is that I'm afraid Fortuner akan lebih boros dari Serena.

Let me tell u my reason. No. 1, Serena is going to be obsolete soon. No. 2, tampangnya Fortuner jauh lebih 'macho' dan elit. No. 3, Dengan Fortuner, saya bisa ke segala macam medan. Last but not least, walaupun saya yakin Fortuner akan kalah dari segi kelegaan, it's still a decent 7-seater.

Hey, how about u trade in your stream for Fortuner, so we could both have identical collections of cars??!

[szli]

Now, heres a final proof to U all that I am not a NMI man, neither am I a Nissan fanatic :

To: Bung Obs, this time, I can understand yr rationale. It is understandable and makes some sense. As U guys know, I too have a great deal of regard for this Fortuner guy.

As I am also aware of c24 and Fortuner's masing masing pros and cons, I fully understand why U want to trade in yr blackie.

My recommendation, abt bensin, not that critical actually. Paling penting utama apa ? Yaitu FUNGSI dan KEBUTUHAN. I am sure Fortuner akan lebih boros dari c24, but if she serves yr needs much better, and U and family are Happier, whats the big deal abt 1:5-6 banding 1:6-7 ? The difference is NOT that big. Paling extra ratusan ribu per bulan at most.

Paling penting bung Obs, most of the time, where and what are U going to do with that blackie or Fortuner ?

If most of the time U ajak family ke touring ke misalnya Bandung, dan lewat jalan mulus, dan U carry 7 people, the c24, meskipun basi, still gets the job done well. The cabin is more roomy.

BUT, if U expect to use yr car alone or jarang 7 orang, lebih sering anda sendiri, or just say 4 people, and most of the time to bad roads for example, then the Fortuner gets the job done well too ! Or if U currently don't have a tall car dan anda sering kena banjir.

These 2 dari dulu saya pernah bilang, they both make an ideal mixed marriage companion. A family will be happy with both a Serena and a Fortuner. The Serena is for family outings, especially long distance cruises. The Fortuner is good for daily activity, and also to rough areas.

Masing masing ada unggulnya dan kelemahannya. Ultimately its like buying a house. Paling penting, anda nanti test drive Fortuner dulu, dan seperti lihat rumah, anda akan langsung rasa gimana, beta tidak ? Senang tidak ? Those feelings will guide U in yr final choice.

As for me, Fortuner might be too rich for my blood. And my c24 is still OK. So paling I see first what the AUV is like. If she is good and seharga Innova, I'll buy that to exchange my Stream.

But if the AUV sucks, ya tinggal lihat harga Fortuner, vs also by that time how much more money have flowed into my pockets !

As Mr. Hdrw bilang, ultimately, its UUD (Undang undang dasar mobil !)

But our car collection is still not the same. Anda punya akan jadi pasangan Fortuner / Innova

I punya akan jadi either Serena / AUV, or Serena / Fortuner.

U guys might not agree, but for me, the MAIN kekuataan these 2 are :

Fortuner - For daily trips to office (asal jangan di gang sempit banget), for short trips with families. For rough / banjir cruising

Serena - For long range family tours to tourist sites.

Just that my advise is, no matter how tempted U are, always test drive the car first before buying the car. Soalnya selama ini, kita ngak pernah rasain langsung Fortuner. Only photos. U will not DP before U see the inside of a house would U ?

Toh unless anda butuh extra mobil cepat, waiting for a few months before getting yr Fortuner is better than DP and who knows, Fortuner is too big for U are what other reasons.

Same with Serena. Waktu itu saya meskipun suka, tapi daya baru DP SETELAH lihat barangnya dulu. Its just for peace of mind and knowing EXACTLY what I am buying.

[pinoh_boy]

Hehehe, Good suggestion Mr.Observer!

Would u trade in your stream into the fortuner? Mr.SZLI!

[conan]

Btw, I am quite seriously considering to trade in my blackie for a fortuner (I know Mr. Conan is gonna say: "told u so").

Eversince I gave you that recommendation, I already knew this day would come

But I have to admit, the Fortuner is very tempting. Especially the 3.0L D4D version. Mr. Observer, may I suggest you wait for a couple of months, and see if the 3.0L version is coming, and if it's still in your budget range?

A family will be happy with both a Serena and a Fortuner. The Serena is for family outings, especially long distance cruises. The Fortuner is good for daily activity, and also to rough areas.

Btw Mr. Szli, more often than not, long-distant cruises would include some rough roads, at least more often than daily, home-to-office routes. What is your solution of this one?

And btw Mr. Szli, that one post of yours above, contains more English-Bahasa mixes than what I can handle. Whew!

But our car collection is still not the same. Anda punya akan jadi pasangan Fortuner / Innova

Well, the Innova is not exactly staying in Mr. Observer's garage.
But I'm so against a Fortuner/Innova combo. It's an overkill! Ugh.
I'd prefer a Nissan and a Toyota than two Toyotas. And what's worse, Fortuner/Innova are both IMVs. Sisters. Almost twins. But they're no Paris/Nicky Hilton

Variety is the spice of life, so they say.

Btw Mr. Observer, don't feel like trading in the saloon instead, yet?

[szli]

Bung Pinoh, again, UUD. Dan juga lihat AUV seperti apa nanti.

Mr. Conan, Kalau saya bilang, long distance tour tergantung ke mana. Some of U suka offroad, camping di hutan, tidur ama ular, biawak its OK. Then the Fortuner bukan the best option. She is the ONLY friend U want to have with U !

BUT, for me, my idea of long range tour kan seperti pakai tol baru Padelarang ke Bandung, lewat jalan yang mulus dan ngak memualkan. Jadi the Serena sudah cukup kalau jalannya mulus. Back to nature is not for me. Kecuali tidur di hotel di Bali yang deconya banyak embel embel nature !

Saya takut anak saya di gigit ular nanti saat tidur !

Kalau lewat jalan rusak, and if its not offroad, it tells me the hotel / resort area don't even bother to repair the roads. So what do U expect dari mutu hotelnya ?

Anyway, saya pernah ajak c24 saya ke tanjakan / jalan gelombang di Pacet / Puncak / Cipanas. Masih OK kok ! Ngak mentok, dan ngangkut 7 orang, masih pandai manjat seperti Iguana. My c24 still don't need strength of a 4X4. Sudah cukup.

Kalau jalanannya lebih parah dari Pacet, sudah mirip di Jalan Raya Perancis, ya mending jangan ke situ. Mobil bisa lewat, saya dan family sudah mual, muntah muntah dulu !

EVEN if I have a Fortuner, saya tetap sayang bawa ke jalan yang rusak banget ! Kasihan suspensinya dan bodinya. No matter what, a Fortuner is still NOT a Land Cruiser nor is she a Nissan Patrol, Land Rover. Jangan lupa, yang di jual di Indo dengan harga OK kan cuman 4X2.

Kalau saya mending regard Fortuner as a city SUV.

Yeah, Mr. Obs, its time to kick yr sedan. Dari pada jual c24 yang masih baru, enak, dan anda bilang sendiri, yr family is getting fond of her.

With a Fortuner / c24, almost ALL options are open to U. Banjir, mau ramai ramai, anda ada mobilnya.

A saloon ? Not more than 5 people. Banjir takut, mau family tour kesempitan. So not very versatile. A saloon is only good for daily trips in the city, say to office.

[observer]

The saloon, I'm going to keep for another 4 years, so it's out of the question.
The other saloon that my wife is using, most likely would be traded in for a new A-class.
So that leaves the Serena, a 7-seater, versus the Fortuner, also a 7-seater, but with more road-terrain versatility. Memang Serena akan lebih nyaman, lebih irit, dan relatif lebih lincah, but hei the Fortuner's look is just so irresistible! (although Mr. Conan's analogy to the Taruna kind of ruin the image a bit )

[conan]

(although Mr. Conan's analogy to the Taruna kind of ruin the image a bit )

Let's refresh our memory then :

[edward]

(although Mr. Conan's analogy to the Taruna kind of ruin the image a bit )

Let's refresh our memory then :

Hahaha ini Taruna Oxxy nya yg terinspirasi ama Fortuner apa sebaliknya?