Mobil '07 yang bisa menghadang Livina & Car of the Year

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Hansen
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Post by Hansen »

HS wrote:Ya namanya aja Liga Irit,masa ama ATPM dikasi boil2 yg boros,ntar ga ada yg beli tu boil, kalo uda tau kons. BBMnya bisa kaget tu..Hehehe..Btw, satu lagi yg gw agak bingung, masa kons. BBM dalam kota Honda jazz idsi lebih boros daripada toyota Yaris??Koq kliatannya ga masuk akal ya..
itu bisa saja karena kondisi test carnya gak laik dalam arti udah berjalan sekian ribu kilometer, jadi mungkin aja mesinnya belum diservis & tune up jadi performanya gak prima...
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Post by HS »

Tapi,honda jazznya tu masih jalan sekitar 400an km koq dan platnya nomor uji coba..Masa hasil kons. bbmnya lebih jelek??Apa mungkin drivernya cara nyetirnya ga sama?
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Post by uch »

johnlegend wrote:toyota tuh pinter.. sengaja hadang2in livina pake avanza/saudaranya terios *lupa nama nya karena tidak laku* jadi pasar masih menganggap *atau dibuat agar menganggap* kalo innova itu posisi nya diatas level livina..

so ada barrier antar segment gitu lah..
Daridulu emang Toyota udah pinter koq... :D Tapi konsumen jg udah mulai pinter. Walaupun Innova mencoba "berkelit" fighting dgn Livina, tetap aja kena imbas. Penjualan Innova dan Yaris semester 1 2007 turun dibanding periode sama 2006. Padahal penjualan mobil secara keseluruhan naik 32%. Konon katenya pihak TAM itu karena pengaruh banjir besar Feb 07. Tapi penjualan Vios dan Camry naik drastis semester ini dibanding 2006. Masa sih banjir bikin orang milih sedan...? Aah.. yg bener bos.. Koq malu2 sih... :D
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Post by Khöedhöe »

uch wrote:
johnlegend wrote:toyota tuh pinter.. sengaja hadang2in livina pake avanza/saudaranya terios *lupa nama nya karena tidak laku* jadi pasar masih menganggap *atau dibuat agar menganggap* kalo innova itu posisi nya diatas level livina..

so ada barrier antar segment gitu lah..
Daridulu emang Toyota udah pinter koq... :D Tapi konsumen jg udah mulai pinter. Walaupun Innova mencoba "berkelit" fighting dgn Livina, tetap aja kena imbas. Penjualan Innova dan Yaris semester 1 2007 turun dibanding periode sama 2006. Padahal penjualan mobil secara keseluruhan naik 32%. Konon katenya pihak TAM itu karena pengaruh banjir besar Feb 07. Tapi penjualan Vios dan Camry naik drastis semester ini dibanding 2006. Masa sih banjir bikin orang milih sedan...? Aah.. yg bener bos.. Koq malu2 sih... :D
iya deh kita ngaku... tapi tolong duonk jangan disebar2 ke yang laen, khan kita jadi malu... :oops:
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Post by johnlegend »

Khöedhöe wrote:
uch wrote:
johnlegend wrote:toyota tuh pinter.. sengaja hadang2in livina pake avanza/saudaranya terios *lupa nama nya karena tidak laku* jadi pasar masih menganggap *atau dibuat agar menganggap* kalo innova itu posisi nya diatas level livina..

so ada barrier antar segment gitu lah..
Daridulu emang Toyota udah pinter koq... :D Tapi konsumen jg udah mulai pinter. Walaupun Innova mencoba "berkelit" fighting dgn Livina, tetap aja kena imbas. Penjualan Innova dan Yaris semester 1 2007 turun dibanding periode sama 2006. Padahal penjualan mobil secara keseluruhan naik 32%. Konon katenya pihak TAM itu karena pengaruh banjir besar Feb 07. Tapi penjualan Vios dan Camry naik drastis semester ini dibanding 2006. Masa sih banjir bikin orang milih sedan...? Aah.. yg bener bos.. Koq malu2 sih... :D
iya deh kita ngaku... tapi tolong duonk jangan disebar2 ke yang laen, khan kita jadi malu... :oops:
ah.. jgn sampe kedengeran bokap gw.. maniac toyota..
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Post by liongkiky »

HS wrote:Tapi,honda jazznya tu masih jalan sekitar 400an km koq dan platnya nomor uji coba..Masa hasil kons. bbmnya lebih jelek??Apa mungkin drivernya cara nyetirnya ga sama?
mungkin dari info ini ada kaitannya:
http://asia.vtec.net/Reviews/JazzVtec/index.html :

Running-In a new Honda - First Hand Experience

For this review, I was using Honda Malaysia's media car which had 10,125 km on the odo and they confirmed with me that they just sent the car for service before passing it to me for review. My own car had less than 5,000km at that time and have only went through the 1st 1,000km service (visual check-up) though I paid for a Honda full synthetic oil change and made in Japan HAMP oil filter replacement. Nevertheless, having two identical cars at the same time with the only difference being in accumulated mileage gave me a unique opportunity to experience the effect of running-in on a modern Honda car. In one word, the differences are HUGE. The main difference is in terms of power as well as fuel economy. The HM Jazz had much better 'urge' in response to throttle input. Both in D and S-mode. By contrast, there is a feeling of 'laziness', a sort of restraint in my own unit at that time. The biggest difference is WOT runs using 7speed mode, through 1st, 2nd, 3rd gears and onwards, something all owners will surely do just for the fun of it. HM's Jazz was really urgent after 3000rpm whereas my own unit still had considerable 'restraint' all the way to the redline. Overall the HM Jazz was quite a bit faster than my own unit. 'Power' wasn't the only difference. I could easily get good fuel economy on HM's Jazz, easily dipping below 8.0l/100km and even 7.0l/100km on many occasions while I struggle to stay on the low side of 8l/100km on my own unit, no matter how much I baby the throttle. Finally the suspension feeling was surprising. The HM unit felt a bit 'softer' than my own unit which felt 'harder'. My unit 'hopped' around a bit more while the HM unit is a little bit more bouncy over uneven roads.

Now with the mileage on my own unit at more than 19,000km, the tables are turned. Based on memory, my unit now feels even more peppy than the HM unit I tested just a few months ago. The engine felt smoother and more responsive to throttle input, especially more so after my trip up to Camerons Highlands where I really gave the Jazz VTEC a good run. It is the same with fuel economy, I have since been regularly getting mileage in the 6.0l/km range and even 5.0l range on some occasions. Even when traffic have been particularly bad for a particular week, overall mileage can still be kept in the mid-8s and that is after getting stuck in traffic jams for the whole week. I had been very careful with my driving style during the initial 1,000km run-in period for my own car and even then, was still careful not to stress it until after the 5,000km accumulated mileage. The HM on the other hand I am very sure have been really pushed to the limit even before it has hit the 1000km run-in period. So personally I think the difference between my unit now and the HM unit when I had it then would also be due to a more careful and rigid run-in procedure.

With the benefit of some real-life experience, especially the unique experience of being able to compare two units side by side which are virtually identical except for their accumulated mileage, I am now even more confident in telling Honda owners that they need to run-in their new Honda car properly before they can really see the true potential of their car, especially in terms of performance and fuel economy. I am sure what I have seen with the Jazz VTEC will apply to other models as well so I am even more confident than ever before in recommending that new Honda owners should be careful to exercise a rigid run-in procedure. The procedure I myself use is for the first 1,000km mileage, I do not exceed 60% of the engine's rated redline and do not go WOT. I myself was careful to not even exceed the half-throttle mark. After the 1,000km mileage has passed, for the next 4,000km mileage until the 5,000km accumulated mileage mark, regularly go WOT and push the engine to red-line but do not stress the car by going on the race track or engaging in extended 'spirited driving', i.e. do not sustain WOT and very high rpms for long periods of time. For myself, the keywords are to 'exercise' the car regularly but do not stress it. There are other equally good procedures of course so what is most important is to adopt one which you feel comfortable with and to follow it as much as possible. I am sure, the car will feel very good after the 5,000km service. Best results, in terms of performance and fuel economy will be after 10,000km mileage.
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Post by FortunerMan »

Tapi Toyota laku berapa ya di IIMS, kayanya panen tuh TAM. Gimana yg lainnya he he...

Dari Kompas...

"Toyota dan Honda mencatat angka penjualan tertinggi dalam Indonesia International Motor Show atau IIMS 2007 di Jakarta Convention Center pada 19-28 Juli lalu. Toyota menjual 3.675 mobil dengan nilai Rp 649.743.077.000, sedangkan Honda menjual 1.007 mobil dengan nilai Rp 191.900.000.000.

Dengan angka penjualan sebesar itu, Toyota dan Honda, yang lokasi stannya berhadap-hadapan di Plenary Hall, menempatkan diri pada urutan pertama dan kedua.

Suzuki menempati urutan ketiga dengan angka penjualan 712 mobil dengan nilai Rp 95.166.900.000. Di bawahnya, pada urutan keempat dan kelima, ditempati oleh Nissan dan Hyundai, masing-masing dengan angka penjualan 426 mobil dengan nilai Rp 87.753.077.000 dan 371 mobil dengan nilai Rp 53.351.750.000"

Kasian deh ama yg sirik ama Toyota...
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Post by maxx »

No offece loh.. bukannya sirik nih, tapi ga salah tuh 3.675 mobil?.. Daihatsu kemana yah?.. yg gw denger penjualan Daihatsu Xenia dan Terios di IIMS juga besar tuh.. apakah dimasukin sbg penjualan TOYOTA.. krn dianggap Avanza dan Rush?

Yup.. toyota memang amazing kalo dilihat dari pencapaian salesnya... hebat!.. salut gw, Padahal banyak merk lain yg tawarin solusi pilihan mobil yg lebih baik.

Ternyata, Orientasi pembeli u/ pake toyota krn resale value bertahan dg depresiasi yg lbh kecil dibanding merk lain masih jadi acuan utama disamping BERES Toyota yg tersebar dimana dan katanya ASS-nya TOP.

Anyway.. gw pribadi ga pernah pake toyota :P entah selalu ill feel sama image oplet dan taksi, kecuali New Camry yg blm kesampean kalo mo beli barunya :D
Meski pun udah 7kali beli mobil baru gw selalu pilih Honda, tp always.. i admired mitsu sporty looks and speed, amazed with toyota sales .. but now i always think about Nissan Livina :P .. one of the best value MPV at the moment with monster engine ... 165jtan 1.8L 6speed, European Comfort, performa mesin sport tp irit, masih tetap stabil meski digenjot sampe 200kph dan ditekuk2 di cipularang ... u/ sementara ini ga bisa berpaling ke MPV yg lain . .he he he... :D
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Post by dion »

berarti nissan hanya mencapai 50% target sales. bagaimanapun masih sulit menyaingi mesin bisnis toyota. hyundai hebat juga, si kuda biru dari utara :-)
FortunerMan wrote:Tapi Toyota laku berapa ya di IIMS, kayanya panen tuh TAM. Gimana yg lainnya he he...

Dari Kompas...

"Toyota dan Honda mencatat angka penjualan tertinggi dalam Indonesia International Motor Show atau IIMS 2007 di Jakarta Convention Center pada 19-28 Juli lalu. Toyota menjual 3.675 mobil dengan nilai Rp 649.743.077.000, sedangkan Honda menjual 1.007 mobil dengan nilai Rp 191.900.000.000.

Dengan angka penjualan sebesar itu, Toyota dan Honda, yang lokasi stannya berhadap-hadapan di Plenary Hall, menempatkan diri pada urutan pertama dan kedua.

Suzuki menempati urutan ketiga dengan angka penjualan 712 mobil dengan nilai Rp 95.166.900.000. Di bawahnya, pada urutan keempat dan kelima, ditempati oleh Nissan dan Hyundai, masing-masing dengan angka penjualan 426 mobil dengan nilai Rp 87.753.077.000 dan 371 mobil dengan nilai Rp 53.351.750.000"

Kasian deh ama yg sirik ama Toyota...
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Post by johnlegend »

pelan2 tapi pasti deh.. nissan baru keluarin 1jurus.. yah maklum deh.. kapasitas pabrik nya masi belum bisa menyamain toyota..
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Post by Hansen »

jadi harap maklum lah...


kapasitas pabrik toyota & nissan ga bisa dibandingin...

tapi nissan udah membuat yang terbaik kok sekarang...
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Post by maxx »

Nissan sudah buat yg terbaik? .. belum deh.. masih jauh dari yg terbaik.

NMI masih harus banyak berbenah diri dan perkuat ASS-nya.

Kalo dari Produk dibilang sudah membuat yg terbaik juga belum tuh.. krn masih ada kekurangan ini dan itu diproduknya.. masih jauh dari kategori "the best of the best" ... hanya saja Nissan udah unjuk gigi dan ngacak2 pasar dg bisa ikutan memberikan pilihan yg dapat buat orang pertimbangkan baik sblm ambil keputusan.
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Post by Risol1 »

Nissan belum yang terbaik tapi seenggaknya udah di jalan yang benar untuk merebut hati konsumen indonesia.
dimulai dari mobil2 SUV dan MPV, lama2 sedannya pun bisa ikut ngetop
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Post by dion »

kita liat apa bengkel2nya siap menampung serbuan mobil2 yg direlease..
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Post by FortunerMan »

An MPV, monster engine? Hi hi hi...kalo saya mikir monster engine itu mesin Viper, mesin Lamborghini.... MPV yah buat istri kalo mau angkut anak2 dan mau ke pasar - itulah tujuan sebenarnya sebuah MPV. Kalo masih muda dan single sih mendingan (jauh) X-Trail lah...mati gaya pake MPV...

Toyota memang keunggulannya bukan paling kenceng paling enak, keunggulannya reliability, spare parts availability dan resale value. Good resale value itu tidak datang dgn ajaib lho, ada sebabnya - dan juga sebaliknya yg buruk resale valuenya - ada sebabnya. Kalo saya sih maunya uang irit bengkel, mobil masih ada harga kalo dah bosen. Buat kebanyakan org yg perlu mobil yg bisa dihandalkan dan kalo rusak bengkel dimana aja dan belum masuk daftar 150 org terkaya di Indonesia (seperti saya)...pilihan ideal ya Toyota atau Honda.
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Post by maxx »

Yup... kita lagi omongin MPV kan bos?.. bukan omongin Sedan Sport Muscle Car sekelas Viper, Lambo maupun Ferarri.

Jelas2 tuh ditulis MPV 165jt mesin 1.8L 6 Speed.. ya dg uang segitu bisa dapet 1.8L 6Speed yg bisa lari 200kph .. udah termasuk spt dapat monster engine .. bukan artinya harus dimasukin mesin HUMMER baru bisa disebut monster engine... .. ya maksudnya dikorelasikan dg harganya seakan2 dapat monster engine... gitu loh...

Coba deh .. mobil MPV apa lagi yg harganya sekelas 165jt dg mesin 1.8L 6Speed, bisa tembus 200kph tapi tetap bisa irit? (Dalkot 1:10-12, luar kota 1:12-14) .. apakah salah kalo for the meantime mesin MR18DE yg dibenamkan ke GL 1.8XV MT disebut monster u/ kelas MPV seharga 165jt ?

PEACE!
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Post by jakarta »

Yo'i, setuju bro maxx :e-clap:
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Post by johnlegend »

maxx wrote:Yup... kita lagi omongin MPV kan bos?.. bukan omongin Sedan Sport Muscle Car sekelas Viper, Lambo maupun Ferarri.

Jelas2 tuh ditulis MPV 165jt mesin 1.8L 6 Speed.. ya dg uang segitu bisa dapet 1.8L 6Speed yg bisa lari 200kph .. udah termasuk spt dapat monster engine .. bukan artinya harus dimasukin mesin HUMMER baru bisa disebut monster engine... .. ya maksudnya dikorelasikan dg harganya seakan2 dapat monster engine... gitu loh...

Coba deh .. mobil MPV apa lagi yg harganya sekelas 165jt dg mesin 1.8L 6Speed, bisa tembus 200kph tapi tetap bisa irit? (Dalkot 1:10-12, luar kota 1:12-14) .. apakah salah kalo for the meantime mesin MR18DE yg dibenamkan ke GL 1.8XV MT disebut monster u/ kelas MPV seharga 165jt ?

PEACE!
damn right.. :e-clap:
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Post by FortunerMan »

Kalo saya bilangnya good economical engine, bukan "monster" engine. Realistis aja, nggak usah terlalu bombastis kalo berbahasa - kesannya ngebual jadinya - disangka sales lho ntar!

Abis ini suara hening bagaikan kuburan ya interiornya? Sekalian gitu lho...
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Post by johnlegend »

mmh.. tp menurut gw livina 1.8lt 6speed emang termasuk lumayan monster in its classssss.... harga segitu lah.. i**o*a mah cuman dikentutin kali yah.. pa lagi boros nya..

hehehe.. canda om..
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Post by johnlegend »

sama2 PUNYA 165jt..

pilih boros ATO hemat? hayoo..

pilih bisa ngebut+hemat ATO lumayan bisa ngebut+boros? hayoo..

pilih 6speed ATO 5speed? hayoo..

kalo saya ada budget 1m buat mobil mah.. kaga dua2nya.. saya pilih yang bener2 monster.. *ya sekali lagi dikelas 1m* hehehe
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Post by johnlegend »

kelupaan..

165jt i**o*a dapet yg mana neh? G manual dapet kaga ya?
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Post by Risol1 »

johnlegend wrote:.. i**o*a mah cuman dikentutin kali yah...
gw cm mao ngingetin aja nih (barangkali ada yang lupa), bahwa GL itu juga engga segala2nya diatas Innova, engga jg bagaikan bumi dan langit keunggulannya sehingga Innova cuma bisa "dikentutin" sama GL.
kalo kita tanya NMI atau salesnya sekalian pun, dia orang engga bakalan bisa claim bahwa GL menang mutlak lawan innova, aplagi kita2 yang cuma pemakai.
kalo dilihat cuma dari produksi dan sales per bulannya, jelas diatas kertas masih menang Innova. Ada bbrp faktor GL lebih unggul, tapi juga ada faktor lain yang innova lebih unggul.
tulisan ini dibuat oleh orang yang bersikap netral (gak punya GL atau Innova)...dan juga untuk menentramkan pemilik2 innova yang mungkin terpengaruh oleh tulisan2 di thread ini :D
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Post by maxx »

Risol1 wrote:
johnlegend wrote:.. i**o*a mah cuman dikentutin kali yah...
gw cm mao ngingetin aja nih (barangkali ada yang lupa), bahwa GL itu juga engga segala2nya diatas Innova, engga jg bagaikan bumi dan langit keunggulannya sehingga Innova cuma bisa "dikentutin" sama GL.
kalo kita tanya NMI atau salesnya sekalian pun, dia orang engga bakalan bisa claim bahwa GL menang mutlak lawan innova, aplagi kita2 yang cuma pemakai.
kalo dilihat cuma dari produksi dan sales per bulannya, jelas diatas kertas masih menang Innova. Ada bbrp faktor GL lebih unggul, tapi juga ada faktor lain yang innova lebih unggul.
tulisan ini dibuat oleh orang yang bersikap netral (gak punya GL atau Innova)...dan juga untuk menentramkan pemilik2 innova yang mungkin terpengaruh oleh tulisan2 di thread ini :D
Mungkin yg dimaksud o/ johnlegend dengan kata2 "dikentutin" itu adalah saat berpacu dijalan bebas hambatan, bukan dilihat dari sisi laju penjualan. Anyway Bos Risol bener kok .. masing2 punya keunggulan ... ga bisa GL dibilang unggul mutlak diatas Innova dan tentunya belum bisa mengalahkan Ipah dalam soal total sales quantity. Tp GL sedikit banyak udah ngacak2 lapak Innova dan Avanza, hal ini ga bisa dipungkiri. :e-clap:
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Post by maxx »

FortunerMan wrote:Kalo saya bilangnya good economical engine, bukan "monster" engine. Realistis aja, nggak usah terlalu bombastis kalo berbahasa - kesannya ngebual jadinya - disangka sales lho ntar!

Abis ini suara hening bagaikan kuburan ya interiornya? Sekalian gitu lho...
Makasih atas input dan saran-nya om.
Mo meluruskan saja > kata "monster engine" yg saya pakai adalah u/ sebuah perumpamaan dari "performa mesin MR18DE 1.8L 6Speed" bukan dari sisi besarnya cc mesin dg angka power & torque yg besar.
Well, persepsi orang mengenai sebuah kata yg dipakai bisa berbeda2, tapi yg saya maksud persis sama spt yg johnlegend bilang, mesin MR18DE 1.8L 6Speed yg dibenamkan pada ruang mesin GL ... buat saya sudah merupakan "monster engine" for its class... terutama u/ MPV dg harga sekelas 165jtan.
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